Bismarck Tribune - North Dakota News - Delivery of booze a bad idea

Delivery of booze a bad idea

Nov 18, 2008 - 08:49:14 CST

The Bismarck City Commission did the right thing in rejecting a request to set up a business delivering alcoholic beverages to homes. The unfortunate truth is that many North Dakotans have serious issues with alcohol abuse. While home delivery of beer, wine and hard liquor might be convenient for some people, for others it provides a temptation they can ill afford.

Other areas of the country allow home delivery of adult beverages, and some states allow alcohol be sold in grocery stores. That does not mean North Dakota has to do the same. We can choose what kind of community we will have.

It's not a matter of legislating morality because there's plenty of existing access at restaurants, bars, clubs and liquor stores. It's a matter of what's important to a community whose citizens may be more at risk that we'd like.

The city commission based its rejection on state law, and the lack of any provisions for home delivery in liquor statutes. That works.

But Bismarck Police Chief Kith Witt also had concerns about enforcement that rang true.

Cody Fleckenstein, who had requested the home-delivery license, had many of the right ideas: those delivering would have to be 21 years of age, required documentation of the buyer's identity and age and that transactions would be on the public records. These stipulations acknowledge many of the issues Witt was concerned about, but it's far from certain that they would be effective checks against abuse.

It doesn't take a close reader of the Tribune to determine that alcohol plays a role in many of the crimes reported in Bismarck-Mandan. And we know it plays a significant role in many of the social issues faced by North Dakotans. The problem isn't new and it isn't restricted to this area. It's a long-term pervasive problem that has taxed some individuals and families without relief. And it has resisted small and large solutions.

It's not a problem that directly affects everyone, be thankful of that. But there's a price for society as a whole, in terms of increased health care costs, and the bills for social and economic crutches that communities and government feel compelled to provide.

Home delivery of beer, wine and hard liquor doesn't need to happen in Bismarck-Mandan. It's a bad idea, and the city commission was right to reject the request.

News > Opinion

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Comments

krten wrote on Nov 25, 2008 6:27 PM:

" Pardon me, but am I the only person slightly startled by the comment "We can choose what kind of community we will have"? To my limited mind, that sounds a tad bit scary... "

care wrote on Nov 25, 2008 12:34 PM:

" to Mandan: I don't think people are bashing new ideas. This idea just happens to be stupid. I'm not defending prescription addiction or anything else you are using to justify this service. I also don't beleive all law makers base laws on their personal attitude. I'm basing my choice on the stats. Drinking is out of control in this state. Why add fuel to the fire. Why make it easier to drink. We are not trying to dictate your drinking. Go buy it if it's so important. "

Sam wrote on Nov 25, 2008 10:01 AM:

" I am writing to those who are bashing our lawmakers and government officials. We are the people of the United States of America. Our elected officials are chosen by us (the people). If you do not like the decisions they make that's fine. Run for office yourself or better yet move to Zimbabwe. Quit your griping!! I'm sure they are doing the best they can for the greater majority. "

lutefisk wrote on Nov 24, 2008 8:07 PM:

" This sounds like a pretty good business model and was a great idea. I agree that it probably isn't necessary, but it would be a convience for some and they would be willing to pay for it. This service isn't going to make any difference to crime or anything else. If someone wants to be a menace they will be one. Maybe pizza delivery or drive thru fast food joints should be banned - I am getting too fat. "

Mandan wrote on Nov 24, 2008 7:58 PM:

" First off chad I am almost 20years older than you so nope not your generation at all. I also am sick and tired of so many of you thinking that your way is the only way of doing things. There are alot of businesses that I am surprised that are out there along some of those making decisions for us all but yet there they are. To allow our government to use their personal attitudes to decide on something without logic is ridiculous and no we do not need laws on top of laws to live. I sure do not want the government telling me when I can leave my own home. The outraged people on here about this is just ridiculous. One of the places I lived that had a delivery place such as this ended up having fewer DUI's but yet would not publish the fact because people in government wanted it shut down but it did not work they are still in business and doing well. Most everything can be delivered to your home these days and having prescriptions delivered should worry people more because you do not need a signature from 21yr old or older. These days the fastest growing drug problem is prescription drugs! "

care wrote on Nov 24, 2008 4:46 PM:

" to Mandan: It's not just the alcoholics that this would affect. You don't have to be alcoholic to make bad choices when you drink. If you can't plan a head for yuor party and get enough to drink than oh well. I'm glad this is not coming to our state!!!!! "

krten wrote on Nov 24, 2008 8:53 AM:

" "That does not mean North Dakota has to do the same. We can choose what kind of community we will have."... Hmm, sounds like we need another Measure #03 to establish an anti-alcohol nine-member committee to educate people on the bad effects of alcohol, just like they are trying to do with tobacco. Or maybe as another commenter posted, home delivery of groceries and obesity? Crimony. "

Chad wrote on Nov 23, 2008 5:42 PM:

" Mandan, I bet we're from the same generation. (I'm 25). I want our generation to make its mark, too. How bout we make our mark by paying off the debt or cleaning up the environment or raising better families in good marriages? I don't think our generation should stake our claim on home delivery of alcohol. We can do better. "

Mandan wrote on Nov 23, 2008 2:03 PM:

" Alot of you are assuming that people "already drunk" are the only type of people to use this type of service and this is not true there are many home parties now than ever before and if you are drinking even 1-3 drinks you 1) do not want to leave your guests and 2) do not want to drive after drinking even 1 drink then this is a very good option.
Chris I agree that already people are getting alcohol delivered not just with the wine clubs but there are many others too. In this instance the delivery person would be doing the same thing as the UPS/Fed Ex drivers do, making sure the person receiving the alcohol is over 21!
I also am tired of our elected officials thinking they know what is best for everyone because there are too many of them that are from a generation ago that do not like anything new! "

Mandan wrote on Nov 23, 2008 1:56 PM:

" Sam you are assuming alot in both your comments! I have alcoholics in my family and I support this type of business idea because I have lived places where this is allowed on top of drive thru liquor stores or barns as some are called. Also I have worked in liquor stores and bartended and making the comment about them stopping by after happy hour at a bar is not accurate. I know alot of people that had bought earlier at liquor stores then ran out and stopped to buy offsale ot the bar because it was closer to their home than a store. I would prefer people stay home then get in their car and drive even a short distance.
Also if you understand about an alcoholic then you know it is a disease and they will do ANYTHING to get more booze including driving drunk and/or suspended if they are not recovering. This is not a bad idea just to new for North Dakotans! "

care wrote on Nov 23, 2008 11:54 AM:

" I am so glad this was written. We do not need this service. Why make it easier for people to get their booze? Plan a head if you must drink. Nothing good would come of, last minute, "I need some more booze" type of decision. ND leads the Nation in underage drinking. The reason is, because so many adults in this state drink and condone it. Let us do something about the major problems alcohol already creates in this state, not add to the problem... "

Chad wrote on Nov 23, 2008 11:27 AM:

" And I understand that there are plenty of responsible drinkers who can handle home delivery, but laws have unintended consequences and this home delivery service would be used by too many people who already abuse alcohol. "

Chad wrote on Nov 23, 2008 11:24 AM:

" Hey I'm normally a free market guy, but If you are at home, you're drunk, and you're out of booze, guess what? 1) You should not be drinking more, and 2) People should not be able to profit by catering to your self-destructive habit! "

BJB wrote on Nov 23, 2008 9:21 AM:

" My dad owned a bar for 25 years. If someone called him up and "ordered" some booze, he would indeed bring it to them. He also took "orders" on Sunday which was a HUGE no-no back in the day. I knew it was against the law because when dad would go get the booze for the customer, we had to use the alley door. Now before you judge my father, please know he was trying to make a living in a very small town. "

Sam wrote on Nov 21, 2008 10:21 AM:

" I disagree with Matt, I work three nights a week at a liquor store. Yes, there are people who stop at the store who have been drinking, but most of them are coming from "Happy Hour" at the bar. Your average home drinker knows how much they will need and plans accordingly. They seldom drink at home, get drunk, then get into their cars and go to the liquor store. "

Tray wrote on Nov 18, 2008 8:21 PM:

" If I have my groceries delivered doesn't mean I'm obese?
If I have my prescriptions delivered doesn't mean I'm an addict?

Having a deliver service for alcohol doesn't make me an alcoholic either.

I would also debate that law enforcement requirements would increase due to such a service.

The problem is the busines plan. To state this plan would cut down on impaired drivers is like saying a gentlemen's club would reduce sex offenders.

Innovate and Create ND. "

yeah right wrote on Nov 18, 2008 7:48 PM:

" This had to be the stupidisth idea I have ever heard. And then try using the reasoning that it will prevent drunk people from driving the streets to get more booze...get real. If anyone is so determined to have more booze after running out, ...go for it...and hopefully you will get stopped for drunk driving, or worse yet, kill someone on your way. Then you can live with the consquences of your stupid decision to drive drunk while getting more booze. I don't think anyone is stupid enough to believe "home delivery" is going to cut down on drunk drivers. Stupid stupid stupid. Drunk stupid idiots will do what they always do...do stupid things. "

Matt wrote on Nov 18, 2008 3:02 PM:

" Way to go, now people can drive drunk from their homes when they run out or have people over. Pretty sure 90 percent of drunk driving is from people leaving their homes to get beer or liqour. Just ask any clerk at the liqour store how many drunk people they have come in. "

privacy wrote on Nov 18, 2008 1:32 PM:

" Does no one else see the problem of "documentation of the buyer's identity and age and that transactions would be on the public records"??? The new police state. I can't believe people debate this and many other issues without looking at the wording of such laws. The fact is it's none of the state's business if I buy beer to drink, pour down the drain, use as fertilizer, or whatever the use might be. Sure, check that the buyer is over the age of 21, but record it forever? For that fact alone this type of service(law), as written, should never come to be. I can hear the retorts now, "but if you have nothing to hide, then you have nothing to fear."

http://www.scribd.com/doc/187225/Ive-Got-Nothing-To-Hide-And-Other-Misunderstandings-of-Privacy

Like Joe, I am tired of new laws that not only [limit free will], but turn our country more and more into a communist state. There is no reason to ever be an "enabler" of a police state with laws such as this. Not everything is life has to be recorded for posterity's sake. "

ND Conservative wrote on Nov 18, 2008 1:12 PM:

" I am having a hard time understanding why this is such a bad idea. I do understand that people are concerned about the few who drink way too much. But, let's face it, those people will buy alchohol to feed their addiction anyway. I actually think home delivery would be a good idea so that if people need to purchase more beer or liquor, and they have already been drinking, they do not climb into their cars and drive to the liquor store. "

Chris wrote on Nov 18, 2008 12:26 PM:

" While I agree with the Commission's decision. North Dakotan's are already able to get wine delivered to their homes. You can order wine from any winery or other retailer in the United States, online or in person, and have it shipped to your house. I've been a member of wine-of-the month club and just had 6 bottles of California wine delivered last week. UPS/FedEx/Postal Service require an in person signature from someone over the age of 21 to accept the delivery. On per-serving basis, wine is no different than beer or hard liquor. However, mail order which can take a few weeks is a far cry from instant 30-minutes-or-less home. But it can be done if properly structured. "

Joe wrote on Nov 18, 2008 11:53 AM:

" To Sam...i don't mean to be inconsiderate of you or your family's personal feelings, but just because you have an alcoholic in your family doesn't mean that they need more rules which in turn would hinder the rest of us. Your personal alcoholic chose to take his/her first drink creating the tendancy to go out or possibly stay in and have not only the first, but the 2nd, 3rd, 4th and so on. They made the decision to drink and the way things are going I don't know that my son's or daughter's will have that option when they become legal age. Is the next step higher taxes on alcoholic products in order to straighten out our economy and also "fix" our "problem" with alcohol much like they did with tobacco? I'm not anti government...I'm anti more government and an extention of power over choice. "

Sam wrote on Nov 18, 2008 11:11 AM:

" Kudos to the Bismarck Tribune's endorsement and the Bismarck City Commission for rejecting the delivery of alcohol request. An alcoholic does not need one more enabler in their life. Anyone with an alcoholic in their family will understand this comment. Thank you!! "

Cole wrote on Nov 18, 2008 10:55 AM:

" I agree with you joe, limitations are more prevalent in society today than ever before. Our society was founded on a system of free enterprise, I say foster this entrepreneur, give him a chance, monitor the results, and react accordingly. I think in a system based on free enterprise it would be more productive to harbor new business ideas than to limit them. "

Soldier wrote on Nov 18, 2008 10:45 AM:

" While I am not a fan of drinking and very rarely drink myself, I do see a lot of potential in home delivery of alcohol. I have been around people that do drink and when they run out, regardless of how much they have had to drink, they go and buy more. Personally, I would rather them stay at home and off the roads when they have been drinking and allow an establishment to deliver to them there. Much safer that way in my mind. "

Thank you Nanny wrote on Nov 18, 2008 10:12 AM:

" Sure is comfortable knowing the good ol Bis Trib is going to protect us all from the dangers of sin. You won a Pullitzer Prize...once. Doubt this kind of thinking and writing will get you another. "

Joe wrote on Nov 18, 2008 9:22 AM:

" I'm against anything and everything that creates more laws/rules/regulations for me to follow. People are independant and free willed and created that way for a reason. People in government are so hell bent on "fixing" everyone that they are slowly taking away peoples rights. I understand that it is not my "right" to have alcohol delivered to my home or place of employment or wherever, but it is my right to be able to make decisions for myself and I honesty feel like I'm slowly losing that right and this is just another example of that. Politicians are people too and the last time I checked they make the paper daily on alcohol related charges just the same as your average "Joe". Nothing we can do now...the people that rule on high have spoken. My "Yes sir..." and "Yes ma'am..." is getting worn out pretty quick. "

Howard wrote on Nov 18, 2008 9:08 AM:

" Thank you Bismarck Tribune for endorsing this. Absolutely nothing good would come from this. Alcohol doesn't make people do something smart... "

hugo wrote on Nov 18, 2008 8:59 AM:

" Delivery of booze a bad idea, no brainer in bisman area!!!! "

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