Bismarck Tribune - Bismarck News - Library Square II OK'd in Mandan

Library Square II OK'd in Mandan

Nov 21, 2007 - 04:03:46 CST

By GORDON WEIXEL
Bismarck Tribune

The $7 million Library Square II project received the blessing of the Mandan City Commission Tuesday. Construction is scheduled to begin in the spring, and the project is to be finished by the end of 2009.

Library Square II will be built on five lots at the corner of First Street and First Avenue and will mirror the original Library Square project at the other end of the block completed in 2001, according to CommunityWorks North Dakota executive director Paul Rechlin. Rechlin's nonprofit organization will co-develop the project with MetroPlains.

The four-story building, being built on the 35,000 square feet of city-owned property that is being sold to the developers for $1, will provide 45 affordable senior apartments along with 4,000 to 5,000 square feet of commercial space on the ground floor. The estimated value of the property is $5.50 a square foot, or $192,500 after demolition and remediation.

The project will mean the removal of the former federal building, which was given to the city in 1963 and used for a library until 2003, at which point the library was moved and the building left empty.

Along with the property, the city will provide the investors with Tax Increment Financing, which will return to them $57,366 annually or $860,492 over 15 years, based on the present property tax mill levy. The investors, expected to provide $5 million in private capital, will be eligible to receive federal income tax exemptions.

City Administrator Jim Neubauer called the project a long-term investment by the city. While the building will be exempt from property taxes for 15 years, at the end of a 30 year period, the city will realize more than $1 million in property tax from the project. The developers also will be paying property taxes on the land of about $5,000 a year. Currently, the city receives no tax revenue from the lots.

Rechlin called it unfortunate that e-mails and letters to the editor have misrepresented the project.

"Our mission is to strengthen communities and not take from them," Rechlin said. "We are not asking $6 million as is being charged. The value of the land and the Tax Increment Financing together, minus taxes on unimproved lands, is roughly $1 million. No check will be written to CommunityWorks, there is no payment out of pocket by the city. The only check written will be by CommunityWorks to the city for taxes on the unimproved property. In 30 years, more than $1 million will be paid back through property taxes to the city. So, a million dollars in non-out-of-pocket funds by the city leverages a $7 million project."

As far as assertions that the developers were out-of-state concerns, Rechlin said CommunityWorks North Dakota is entirely a state nonprofit organization with strong ties to Mandan. MetroPlains investors will have no ownership whatsoever in the building, Rechlin said, and only a limited partner.

The investors will receive the income tax credits, but once the Tax Increment Financing is completed in 15 years, the limited partners are out, said Rechlin.

"It's kind of a dream situation. You're getting investment from out of state, yet are retaining local ownership and management," Rechlin said.

It was further explained that Mandan is in need of affordable low-income housing for seniors. Library Square has a waiting list of 80 to 100 eligible seniors, and there is a need for more than 1,000 of these type of apartments in Mandan.

Mandan resident Susan Beehler was the only person to oppose the project. After her presentation, Commissioners Tim Helbling and Dan Ulmer accusedd her of misrepresenting the facts.

Beehler was also criticized for wasting city staff time and resources with unreasonable requests.

Beehler replied that the amount the city was providing didn't reflect the true amount the developer was receiving. She also said that a petition would be circulating in an attempt to save the former library.

Commissioners unanimously approved a series of motions that modified the city's Urban Renewal Plan, approved the lot purchase agreement, provided the tax increment financing and approved a business incentive agreement protecting the city if the developers do not meet the project goals.

(Reach reporter Gordon Weixel at 250-8255 or gordon.weixel@;bismarcktribun. com.)

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Comments

Susan Beehler wrote on Nov 27, 2007 8:55 PM:

" Thanks for the back up SST. I am amazed at 'amazing to me'. You highlight my point "somehow doesn't compute," the reaction the city has to one lady stating her opinion doesn't compute, why are they so defensive, I have tried to cooperate by sharing what I have found and they take offense, it is not about being wrong or right it is about how some of their decisions affect some residents. If someone runs your foot over, you yell out and say your on my foot, the person on your foot would be wise not to argue with whether they are on your foot and whether you have a right to complain. Through my viewpoint the city is running over my foot, it probably won't kill ya but it can cause alot of pain. When they get it, then real progress will began. "

SST wrote on Nov 27, 2007 3:55 PM:

" Well I'm not tired of it. I like that the commissioners have to validate their decisions and how the dollars will impact me. I will never give the government blanket approval. They were elected but the checks and balances require that they are monitored. I will tell you what I am tired of. I don't think the downtown area is the area Mandan should be focusing all its attention on. I think a new area should be developed and if they build the new center their that would be an anchor to the area. That will not be downtown. "

Amazing to me: wrote on Nov 27, 2007 3:32 PM:

" I have been watching this city government witch hunt for far too long, and personally I am tired of it. Sure, government officials can take criticism, but this has all just gone too far, with every move they make being criticized, no matter what it is. It's bad for the city to have this constant negative bashing all the time. It isn't coming from the commission! They are just trying to do their jobs for the whole of the community. Disagreeing is one thing, voicing opinions is one thing, but this is a constant attack that just never ends. I think our city is looking far better than it has in the past, it's more neat and clean, with many attractive things showing up. There have been many positive steps forward, regardless of the opposition. I applaud our city leaders for all their efforts. "

SST wrote on Nov 27, 2007 3:01 PM:

" AFter reading Amazing to me's comments I just wanted to say thank you Susan. To "amazing to me" if all you can do is try to slam one person and have nothing else to say it makes me believe you are either in city government or related to someone who is. If the commissioners and others believe in what they are doing I am sure they can take some criticism for their votes and decisions. If not, they should call it quits. It is called a democracy when people can disagree with each other and voice their opinion. I don't care one way or another what goes into the space because I know I will end up paying for it, but the library is a unique building and will be a major loss in the downtown area. "

Amazing to me: wrote on Nov 27, 2007 1:47 PM:

" Well, I'm not part of the government, but sometimes we just have to trust in others. Elected officials do the best they can with what they have to work with, and I think supporting them goes a lot further than fighting them every step of the way. A lot more can be accomplished with cooperation. "

To "Amazing to me" wrote on Nov 27, 2007 10:28 AM:

" -----Your comment reminds of "Trust Me, I'm From The Government." Ha-Ha! "

Amazing to me: wrote on Nov 26, 2007 1:51 PM:

" It's amazing to me how one person can know more than the city government, the city attorney, and the other city leaders and administrators involved in making decisions. During the decision making process, it's more than one that makes the decisions, more than one that votes, and more than one that offers perspectives and suggestions and does research into things. How can all these people be wrong all the time and one person be right? This bashing the city government without ever being in their shoes or being a REAL part of the decision making somehow doesn't compute. And most, if not all, of the people making these decisions live and pay taxes in Mandan, just like the rest of us. Yep, it's amazing to me . "

Susan Beehler wrote on Nov 26, 2007 10:21 AM:

" To MRS BEEHLER, Are you a Mrs. Beehler also? I love Mandan, I do not hate the city government and I do not hate the city commissioners. I am sorry you have believed my comments are hate. I do not believe in sitting by and not saying something when I feel it is affecting many people who are still living in Mandan. I do not know your situation, but if you are not living and paying taxes in Mandan, maybe you have a very narrow picture of what is taking place in Mandan. Things can't change for the best if no one speaks out, my words are my perspective, my opinion, you do not agree, and the city does not agree, this is not hate it is not agreeing. Please do not use MRS BEEHLER if you are not a Beehler, people may think you are me. Anger and hate are two different things, and I believe anger is just a human emotion, which should be allowed to be expressed but not with violence. If you see it as angry words, my true emotion is frustration in the city not being able to see how their actions are affecting taxpayers. Most will just move away and not bothering saying anything, I do not think that is a positive solution, open dialogue is. The blog provides a safe way of expressing opinions and everyone knows where I stand, I use my name. "

Susan Beehler wrote on Nov 26, 2007 10:18 AM:

" To MRS BEEHLER, Are you a Mrs. Beehler also? I love Mandan, I do not hate the city government and I do not hate the city commissioners. I am sorry you have believed my comments are hate. I do not believe in sitting by and not saying something when I feel it is affecting many people who are still living in Mandan. I do not know your situation, but if you are not living and paying taxes in Mandan, maybe you have a very narrow picture of what is taking place in Mandan. Things can change for the best if no one speaks out, my words are my perspective, my opinion, you do not agree, and the city does not agree, this is not hate it is not agreeing. Please do not use MRS BEEHLER if you are not a Beehler, people may think you are me. Anger and hate are two different things, and I believe anger is just a human emotion, which should be allowed to be expressed but not with violence. If you see it as angry words, my true emotion is frustration in the city not being able to see how their actions are affecting taxpayers. Most will just move away and not bothering saying anything, I do not think that is a positive solution, open dialogue is. The blog provides a safe way of expressing opinions and everyone knows where I stand, I use my name. "

cdog wrote on Nov 26, 2007 9:00 AM:

" To Honzo. Hey, I was stating what I thought was in a report to the City on the downtown development. Once again if memory serves, the recommendation was to build housing for the workers and owners of the new businesses in the downtown area, NOT senior housing. Yes I know downtown Mandan has necessities. I guess in general my point was that a report, to the City on the downtown development was disreagrded in the aspect of housing. "

MRS, BEEHLER wrote on Nov 26, 2007 7:51 AM:

" You can bust up the city with all of your very angry words, I think you do that in most of your posts. I read the Tribune online most every day because I like to stay in touch with the place I grew up. I live 1300 miles away and your hate for the goverment in Mandan can reach a long ways, It has effected me! "

Jesse wrote on Nov 26, 2007 7:47 AM:

" One of my best friends has had her name on the waiting list for some time now. I ask everyone if this project is not built where is she going to move to?? She is awaiting this so she can remain in Mandan! Sure she could move someplace else, but where do you find a nice place with only people around your age? No kids, If Mandan had this kind of place 15 years ago I might not have ever moved to Arizona 10 years ago. I now this is what is keeping her there now "

To "Its Simple" wrote on Nov 25, 2007 11:31 PM:

" ``RE:``"...all you can do is what the laws allow..." That's darn good advice for Mandan's City Government, both the elected and the employed. If they followed "...what the laws allow" they would NEVER had gone for this Lib Square Deal. Too many laws ignored. For as studied as they act this fiasco is, it is not. I say "nice job," too, Mr. Rechlin. woo-wee!!! "

Susan Beehler wrote on Nov 25, 2007 7:24 PM:

" It's simple it is just my opinion, an opinion cannot bust up a city. I don't believe they gave the taxpayer the best deal, the developer in this got the best deal, read the law on it and you will see they could have written alot more accountability in what they gave them. "

Concerned wrote on Nov 25, 2007 11:09 AM:

" way to go Ellen, another business with no tax relief. keep up the good work. "

It's simple wrote on Nov 25, 2007 8:45 AM:

" Susan all you can do is what the laws allow, I don't believe the laws will allow Mandan to give a property tax break to a home owner for 10 or 15 years, but I think they did follow the law on the excemptions granted library square. You need to focus your energy on changing the laws, not trying to bust up and destroy the City for every move they make. Have a great Day! "

Need a mix: wrote on Nov 25, 2007 12:55 AM:

" I agree with To Susan, that building is doing nothing and if it is worked on there are no guarantees it will be functional at all. Sometimes you just have to let go. There are many old buildings in Mandan that have been restored and serve a purpose, as well as preserving history. I don't believe this could be one of them. I believe that Library Square II would be a great asset to this city. Our returns will come, immediate: we will have a nice building and an attractive city block which will house elderly, and later: the tax returns in the future, besides the building being attractive and housing elderly then, too. I think it was a good decision, and we need to support our government in what they are trying to do for this city. Take a look around, this city has improvements in every direction. It is looking cleaner and neater, buildings are being renovated and are looking attractive, new buildings are popping up, there has definitely been a forward movement. I have said it before, the city government and leaders make decisions that they feel will benefit the whole, not just a few. Sure we pay taxes, but I am seeing many things that we are getting back for those taxes. I guess I see the glass half full, and feel that supporting our city government is the respectful thing to do, since I sure couldn't do their job and have no desire to try. "

Susan Beehler wrote on Nov 24, 2007 11:04 PM:

" I forgot to add, if you do the math, an easy way to guarantee people staying in Mandan is give 20 homes a 15 year tax break, (20 x 15= 300) times $3,000 is about the tax break the city said they are giving, which I think is greatly underestimated. or better yet give 40 homeowners $1500 off their taxes and people would probably line up to move into Mandan, especially if you did this 4 years apart like the Library Sq 1 and Library Sq 2. It would be like a Mandan lotto, you could bet would care about their taxes if individuals would benefit, funny thing is the city is giving away your tax dollars to 44 which will do little to generate any direct benefit, at least a homeowner would, generate a whole lot more tax revenue than these two buildings will in the next 15 years. "

Susan Beehler wrote on Nov 24, 2007 10:49 PM:

" To to Susan Who do you think Community Works ND is ? It is a non-profit, Whose money do you think they are using? Their other building pays $3,000 a year in taxes. The city tore down the house that was paying taxes and for 4 years, the taxpayers have been paying the school, county taxes, special assessments on the former library and surrounding property waiting for Community Works ND to get federal tax dollars so they can access a 15 year tax break for out of state investors. Why would I want to use your money, my idea would take no more than any other small business coming into Mandan. A high rise paid with our tax dollars will do nothing to keep people in Mandan, good streets, open government and lower taxes would go a lot further. It sounds like you have not done your research and have been taken for a ride. YOU are paying for the building, now and for the next 15 years. Are you going to be around in 15 - 30 years for your payback in tax reduction? "

To Susan wrote on Nov 24, 2007 5:09 PM:

" Just what do we have now? How much tax revenue does this property generate in taxes to help lower my tax bill? How much does this property pay to help lower the school taxes? How much will it take $$ of my hard earned tax money if this building is to stay and get repaired and go into some non-profits hands??? What I like about people like you, is you always have all these great ideas but you want to use my money to do them. Try using your own money to do these projects. NOT MINE! I totally agree with what they are doing here and I think Library Square I was a great addition to Mandan and I hope #II will keep more of our people on this side of the river. We need more of these buildings even if it may take 15 years to start generating taxes. "

Susan Beehler wrote on Nov 24, 2007 4:33 PM:

" To Need a mix, What about the residents here? I believe the property tax issues is our toughest issues facing us and the current city commission is not moving us forward in lower our taxes enough. The cost to tear down a building is not necessarily the most economic way. If Library Square 2 develpers do as they say they will spend a bunch of money to remove a building which could be used for their offices about the same amount of square space could be acheived from the former library, the feasibility reports they supposedly did on this project do not exist, the city admitted to this with the attorney general's opinion in August, but the worst of it; is the amount of tax dollars being spent for very little return on our dollar. The residents now; need to keep the taxes at bay and this will effect schools, county and parks they will reap no benefit for 15 to 30 years, that is not progress that is standing still. Wapheton is using the exact same building and it is beautiful, it is all how you look at, with a can do attitude. "

Need a mix: wrote on Nov 24, 2007 1:47 PM:

" Mandan has history here, but we also need to move forward. History works for tourists once in a while, but what about the current residents? Some of the old buildings have been saved and are quite attractive and usable, functional!! The old library doesn't offer that promise. With all the complaining about money being spent, why put a large amount of money in a building that may never be able to be used? To the landlord: you will rent your apartments. Sure, you would rather have an elderly person, but would that elderly person really want to spend their days and nights listening to a mother and three kids? The needs of the renter should be met, too. All these young people building these new homes will need apartments as soon as their two year tax exemption is up, so be patient. The young are creating their own problems, doesn't mean we should pass that on to the elderly! "

the truth wrote on Nov 24, 2007 10:26 AM:

" Just because young couples are buying or building new homes does not mean that they have the means to afford it. Many people in today's society think that they have to have that type of home, instead of a used one, because it is seen as nothing more than a materialistic status symbol. The younger folks doing this take out outrageous loans from the bank and add those payments onto, I'm assuming, high student loans. And who knows what other credit card debt they have incurred. There is too much of an emphasis on having a nice home and that pressures youth to overspend and overextend their credit. It's stuff like this that has economists worried. Low-income housing might not be status worthy, but in the long wrong it can be the smartest choice. I believe it is a city's job to provide something like that to it residents, young and old, in order to grow. And hey, if you've got more people living in your city, that's more tax revenue to use, or waste. "

To Facts wrote on Nov 24, 2007 9:57 AM:

" Old buildings are not really much different then old people. You like to keep them around but they do cost ALL of us a great amount of money to maintain and keep in a useable condition. I can only allow the government to take so much of my money so I would rather have my tax money spent keeping the old people around and get rid of the old buildings. Didn't the city spend ton's of my money to fix and repair the old freight house and the depot? How is that getting rid of all of the old buildings??? "

Facts wrote on Nov 24, 2007 8:40 AM:

" As far as a commission 20 years ago, one of our commissioners is from almost that long ago, 20 years ago was bull doze mentality in most cities, this commission is acting like what most cities have figured out is not best for their cities, 20 years ago. If they are thinking of our future why do we have to wait 30 years for some benefit, they had the choice to require the tax benefit to happen sooner. Whether you want to admit it or not; people over 80 need a lot of public services, medicare etc, the county is who pays for the increased costs, and the young families moving in, how long do you think they will stay after they establish themselves, living here and working in Bismarck? It isn't too hard to figure out, young people are mobile and they will just leave when they don't like the taxes, they will not even bother to complain, they will pack up and move. "

mANDAN bOY wrote on Nov 24, 2007 8:07 AM:

" It looks like the City of Mandan is going in circles. I've lost intrest in this whole mess. I dont see anything changing anytime soon. We need some fresh faces in our local goverment. Starting with the county commissioners and their unjustified high paychecks. "

Apartment owner wrote on Nov 24, 2007 6:49 AM:

" It took over 2 years to fill Library Square. As an apartment owner, I checked this carefully despite the "waiting list" they always claim. Don't believe everything you read, such as the initial cost of the new school. It took those 2 years for us to recoup, unable to raise rents, but lower them. With the present vitality in the state, the rents can at last, be raised. We will again be affected. No one sees that building this kind of unit takes the best renter away from other landlords. If you were a landlord, what would you prefer, an older person or unwed mothers with children? If Mandan wants to be progressive, what we need is assisted living. "

New homes: wrote on Nov 23, 2007 10:44 PM:

" Drive around our city. Go out south and look at all the new housing, drive out west of the Seas. Those are not the elderly building all these new homes. In this day and age, young couples don't start out in older homes anymore, they get brand new right from the start. I don't think we are short on young people and middle aged couples according to all the new housing being built and occupied. Young people have jobs and means to start their investments, including housing. The aged have to pay, too, but this provides them with a place to live. And has no one heard what will be coming into this city in taxes in 15 to 30 years from this property? If we had a commission 20 years ago that thought like the current one, we would have a lot more tax dollars in this town. Listen to all the facts, not just the ones that support your arguments!! "

the truth wrote on Nov 23, 2007 2:34 PM:

" I agree with Baby T in that the Bismarck/Mandan area needs more affordable housing for it's younger citizens. The single mom's and dad's out there or the the young couple just getting started. In doing so more of the area's children might actually want to stick around the area and not have to move somewhere else. There is a problem in a city when there is affordable housing being built for it's aging population. That means that the young people aren't sticking around, and I doubt they are off building or buying homes. While Mandan is cleaning up the city, and I will give them credit for doing a good job there, the bottom line is you need a population to support the city, something the retired population can no longer do. "

Mandan resident wrote on Nov 23, 2007 12:45 AM:

" To Happy Thanksgiving, How would Mrs. Beehler personally "benifit" and how can any one person lead a city, Mandan is run by a commission? I thankful we live in america and anyone can state their opinion, even you. "

Susan Beehler wrote on Nov 22, 2007 6:59 PM:

" Happy Thanksgiving! "

happy thanksgiving wrote on Nov 22, 2007 1:40 PM:

" We all have much to be thankful for on this great day! I am very happy and thankful that I live in Mandan and things are starting to look up, the town is cleaning up and the rebuilding process has begun. I am most thankful that Mrs. Beehler is not leading our city and making decisions that effect me and my children for her personal benifit. "

Susan Beehler wrote on Nov 22, 2007 9:48 AM:

" To good job: if the city is looking at the big picture and out for the whole city, then why didn't they write tax aggreement, the business incentive and the purchase aggreement, to favor the taxpayer,read them at bbuz.biz for yourself, not the developer, look at the documents, they tell who the city is thinking of and it is not the taxpayers, it is the developer. Mandan should not sell themselves out, there are people who want to live here. I am opposed to the blatant favoritism to the developer rather the taxpayer which they have been elected to protect. This is no longer just about a building it is about our tax dollars. "

Good job, Mandan: wrote on Nov 21, 2007 10:44 PM:

" It's all fine and well to preserve some history, but that old library has seen better days and served it's purpose. If we are going to preserve something, let it be a usable building that can be made attractive and safe. Just because Mandan is providing housing for the elderly doesn't mean we are a geriatric ward!! For dumb. You don't think there are elderly in other cities? Should all people be forced out of town at age 55? These people will support Mandan and it's businesses much more than the younger set, and have probably contributed much to the city in years past. This will show progress and look impressive, more impressive than an old decaying building sitting there with no function. I firmly believe our city leaders are looking at the whole picture, not just what is happening today. Their decisions are based on what is good for the whole of the community, not one or two here and there who oppose progress. Good work, Commission. You don't let the attacks and negativity take you down or stand in the way of what will be best in the future for this town. I respect our commission and their dedication. "

Where's Ulmer? wrote on Nov 21, 2007 2:40 PM:

" To responding I found Dan he is on a video on the tribune website talking about the event center coming in a couple of years. "

X mandan native wrote on Nov 21, 2007 1:52 PM:

" I think the city commission had it right to begin with when they started bulldozing some of the downtown buildings. Problem is, they stopped. "

Responding wrote on Nov 21, 2007 1:46 PM:

" To Don't Get It: I think you really don't get it. You stated that Ulmer has faithfully attended meetings of the Mandan City Commission. Then your next sentence you say that he has maybe missed two. It appears that you are contradicting yourself. I am not referring to just the meetings regarding Library Square II. Their track record speaks loud and clear of lack of attendance on their part of the years spent on the Commission. I have noticed this time and again of those not in attendance in articles stated in the newspaper. "

Support Mandan wrote on Nov 21, 2007 12:16 PM:

" Thank you Paul Rechlin and the Mandan City Commission - great presentation. We need more people looking at things like this for Mandan and not someone trying to stifle it. Thank you for standing up Dan and Tim for the misinformation that was presented to the citizens of Mandan in a very bad light - dont need to waste more city staff, Community WOrks staff and state employee staff time on these silly and frivolous matters that matter to one or very few people. "

Honzo wrote on Nov 21, 2007 11:44 AM:

" hey cdog, the last time I checked groceries, fuel, and household goods do NOT qualify as disposable income. Those would be classified as necessities or would you like to poll the residents at Library Square to see how many of them own an ipod? "

Don't get it wrote on Nov 21, 2007 11:41 AM:

" To Responding, what is your point, all the commissioners show up to the meetings very faithfully, Ulmer has maybe missed two times, Is this your point? Sandi Tibke left early last night because she was having contractions, haven't heard if she had her baby. So what is your point. "

Susan Beehler wrote on Nov 21, 2007 11:38 AM:

" To another Mandan resident, How much "life" did Library Square 1 bring to Mandan? Since it has been built we have very few new businesses, we have lost record numbers of businesses. It is housing pure and simple, this is not some major economic tool. It will be built with our tax dollars just like the majority of improvements in the look of downtown, bought with our tax dollars. It is not moving forward it is moving our tax dollars to someone else's pocketbook. Movement is not necessarily progress. "

Responding wrote on Nov 21, 2007 10:46 AM:

" To Mandan Native: Lamont & Ulmer aren't the only members on the city commission. Check the times when & who, as members of the commission, didn't find it necessary to attend meetings. "

Point to Ponder wrote on Nov 21, 2007 10:41 AM:

" I agree with BabyT and cdog. Why is the Mandan city commission so determined to turn Mandan into a geriatric ward? "

Another Mandan resident wrote on Nov 21, 2007 10:13 AM:

" I am anxious to see this project move forward! We need more “life” in downtown Mandan. The first Library Square property is a wonderful development that has a waiting list for folks wanting to get in. The residents of that property and the new property are and will spend their money at Mandan grocery stores, restaurants, drug stores, gas stations, etc. They are older people that do not want to venture over to the big box retailers in Bismarck. As a property owner and taxpayer, I truly believe this is good for Mandan. We need more folks that want to live and shop in OUR community. "

Susan Beehler wrote on Nov 21, 2007 10:11 AM:

" To Mandanite, The issue is two fold, Yes, I do want to see the library preserved, a more important issue for me is the taxpayers are investing the majority of the money. Not much has been reported about the implications of TIF financing; tax increment financing. As a business owner wouldn't you want to build in Mandan if you did not have to pay taxes for 15 years? Mandan residents need to open their eyes and find out why our taxes are so high, these projects are contributing to the tax gouging in Mandan. I have posted what I presented to the city at bbuz.biz If you don't like your taxes, start digging and find out where the money is going. 5 plus 1 is 6, they want to downplay 6 million and make it sound like I don't know what I am talking about but IRS Tax credits are money and they are tax dollars if they weren't than how could you save on your taxes if you didn't get them. Tax credits are not the same as what most get as a refund, most are getting a refund because they have paid in too much, these credits are giving to those who make so much, and trade their cash for them, to avoid paying taxes on the profit they make in other ways. It is legal but it causes other taxpayers to foot the bill. "

Yan wrote on Nov 21, 2007 10:09 AM:

" Two years ago, the library was in fine shape; with its construction, I can't imagine that's changed much. MetroPlains admitted it could build Library Square II on the back half of the block, which would save the library, but they didn't want to. No real reason, just didn't want to. There is room for the new in our cities and towns in North Dakota, but the new needn't destroy the valuable historic character of towns if city administration plans ahead. We can have character AND development -- it's what leads to quality of life. Too bad Mandan doesn't see this. "

The Great Ape wrote on Nov 21, 2007 10:08 AM:

" Oh my I say. Loss of the library does not bother me. What bothers me is that they are getting the land for $1.00 and basically a 15 year property tax exemption. Sure the City is getting no present tax dollars from the land, but in a couple of years a four story building will be present. Will the $5,000 cover the related costs for that property or will the rest of the CIty again be participating as a partner in another project? One mil over 30 years is really not that much. And we all know what will happen in year 16 through year 30; or don,t we? Well, oh my, I'm off to Central Market for a bundle of bananas, then back to Library Square I, to take a position of interest atop the building to watch and see. Hope my bananas last the 30 years! Better yet hope I do? "

Resident wrote on Nov 21, 2007 9:01 AM:

" How about giving us tax payers a break too, I understand that this will bring long term growth, but come on us tax payers will have to foot their bill. Where's are tax break? "

Support wrote on Nov 21, 2007 8:56 AM:

" I agree with you Mandanite, lets move forward. Change is difficult sometimes but the long term benefits are much greater with additional housing. These folks would benefit from living very close to the shops we currently have and hopefully additional shops as Mandan continues to improve its downtown area. Kudos to the commission. "

Mandan Native wrote on Nov 21, 2007 8:10 AM:

" Good Job Mandan! This is why we reelected Ulmer and LaMont. They stood up to the criticism and are getting the job done. Mandan can not stay the same forever. Library Square is a great assest to Mandan. We are the fifth largest city in the State, its about time we start acting like it. Bring on the Events Center!!! "

BabyT wrote on Nov 21, 2007 8:00 AM:

" Affordable 'senior' apartments? I always wondered why it was entirely legal to practice age descrimination, as long as you discriminated against youth, not age. Bis/Man in general needs more affordable living for YOUNGER people to fill the thousands of $8-$10 jobs around town. You don't buy a $150k house working an $8/hour job. "

cdog wrote on Nov 21, 2007 7:55 AM:

" If memory serves, one report recommended AGAINST senior housing for the immediate downtown area. Just how much disposable income do you think seniors have? Poor use of this property in my opinion. "

Mandanite wrote on Nov 21, 2007 7:19 AM:

" I think what is making some people upset about this issue is simply losing the old library. People generally do not like change and removing the old library and altering the familiarity of a well traveled street I believe is the core issue. However, the old library is in bad shape and either needs to be fully restored or removed. Should anyone think about restoring it then the question becomes; what shall we put into it? I think the Mandan Commission is correct! Bring in the new! The library square project has added a lot to the downtown Mandan area. Their building is aesthetically pleasing and provides needed affordable shelter for an aging population base. I'm a Bismarck business owner and Mandan resident. Mandan keep up the good work and I'll bring my company back home. "

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