Bismarck, North Dakota News

" $12.00 an hour is a "getting by wage" with kids. "

" Higher wages and lower gas prices "

" Did you really say $12 isn't a living wage for North Dakota? You're joking right? "

" To: not quite middle class wrote on March 11, 2007 11:35 AM . . . You two appear to represent the vast numbers of "Wage Slaves" employed in North Dakota. As you are aware, $12.00 per hour is NOT a "Living Wage" here in N.D. The price of everything has gone up dramatically in the past 10 years and the wages have not been even close to balancing out the discrepancy of a "Living Wage" and the Minimum Wage." "

" Not quite middle class: I see you understand the concept. Raising the minimum wage actually brings more people down to the poverty level (because the poverty level goes up along with the minimum wage) that it brings people out of the poverty level. For people like you and I, this bill is the equivilant to a $2 an hour reduction in wages. "

" Maybe the people who make minimum wage will be able to buy more if prices don't increase (but they most certainly will- businesses have to cover their expenses-that's a fact)I, not making minimum wage, will not get a boost in pay, so it will damage my family budget. My husband and I each average about $12.00 an hour with 2 kids, hardly "cushy". "

" Dreamrich_B_real: Prices go up for lots of reasons, but to say that prices will not go up when wages are increased is just ignorant. You were right when you said that small businesses are struggling for lots of reasons - they are. Why add more burden to them? Especially since it isn't going to really help anyone anyway? By the way, you still never answered the question - if higher wages are the cure all for everything, why not make minimum wage $20 an hour? "

" So your solution is to keep the minimum wage at $5.15 forever then? Who does that HELP? As for businesses being hurt by the minimum wage going up, there are plenty of other things hurting small businesses other than having to pay more wages. Small businesses are being killed by places like Walmart; and chain stores that come to the area. Staying competitive is the name of the game. That includes paying competitive wages. As for your business owner friend, if I was a business owner I would WANT to pay my employees more than just a pathetic minimum wage! The minimum wage has been $5.15 since I was barely in my 20's WITHOUT going up, and prices have STILL managed to rise to exhorbant amounts; aka cost of living has gone up without income rising to meet it! Explain the reason for THAT then!! How can the minimum wage going up cause higher prices, when prices have been going UP for YEARS and the minimum wage has STAYED THE SAME?? "

" dreamrich_B_real: My middle class status. Now that's funny. I am by no means well off and I have no problems with people trying to better themselves. I just don't think that raising the minimum wage is going to do anything for anyone. I think it is amazing that you have chosen to attack my position WITHOUT ADDRESSING THE POINTS MADE IN MY LAST COMMENT WHAT-SO-EVER. What is up with that. If raising the minum wage helps everyone and it doesn't hurt businesses at all and if the businesses actually make more money by paying the higher way because people can afford to buy more stuff and if it isn't going to lead to higher inflation, then why not make the minimum wage $20 and hour? If you can give me any sort of reasonable explanation to that, I will concede defeat. But you don't even try to address that point. You just keep on coming back with the same old rhetoric - kind of like a broken record. "

" It is just another exercise of "Smoke and Mirrors" from the Republican controlled 2007 Legislature. "You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time." Abraham Lincoln, (attributed) 16th president of US (1809 - 1865) "

" The mimimum wage has been $5.15 for FAR longer than it should have been. Mike, if YOU had to live on $5.15 an hour, I doubt you would be saying that. Most of us get raises and don't expect other people to have a problem with it. I hardly call raising the minimum wage from $5.15 to $7.50 a great hardship. If you want to protest injustice in the world, there are plenty of issues to choose from. There's a lot of fleasing out there on a corporate level that no one seems to really mind; but GOD forbid we raise the minimum wage! I think maybe you like your middle class status just a little too much... "

" OK, so here is the deal. If higher wages has nothing to do with higher prices and if business owners in these small towns evidently all have a cash surplus that they are hoarding to themselves instead of paying higher wages, and if everyone benefits from a higher minimum wage, I say why not make minimum wage $20 an hour? Evidently business owners won't have to raise prices to cover the increase, and raising the minimum wage has nothing to do with inflation. Everyone will have more money to spend so the business owners that are forced to pay the higher wages will get rich selling more products. Everyone in the country will be rich. I wonder why noone has thought of this before? Could it be that it wouldn't work out that way? Could it be that is why they are hoping if they raise it little by little, noone will notice the actualy effects of thier actions? "

" to MQ actually Job service only has the numbers not ages but I know quite a few people that work for minumum because of the smaller towns they live in. Also to to Mandan and Inflation if costs were directly due to minimum wage increase then I would be able to buy the same amount of goods at 5.15 as I did with 3.45 so inflation has gone up alot more than minimum so the fact is raising the minimum did not spike prices. Minimum should go up with inflation just as all wages should but that is not happening. Also other thatn the 21,000 that are making minimum there are alot more that are making less than the proposed minimum so at least there is a chance for people close to or below poverty to actually come up some. Obviously the more people make the more they spend so upping prices is not the only option. "

" A do nothing govenor along with a do nothing legislators high-fiving each other over the fact they signed a do nothing minimum wage bill! Just another photo opportunity for the boys!!!!! "

" So when wages go up do you suppose that the businesses just eat that cost then? I know the owner of a resturant personally. When gas goes up, his delivery costs go up and he raises menu prices. If he was forced to raise wages, I know for a FACT that he would raise menu prices again. I don't think he is the excption. What would you do if you were the business owner? Would you just go hungry, or would you adjust your prices to cover your costs? "

" To: Mandan wrote on March 09, 2007 8:48 AM:" . . . . You are failing to include the "cost of inflation." Everything was cheaper at $3.15 per hour than now at $5.15 per hour. Think before you write something. Your blog is a mute subject! "

" You just made Mike R's point!!! Mike R is correct- I am an accountant at a local business and we markup our products based on what we need to cover our expenses. Up goes our expenses, then up goes our prices. Period. "

" to Mike R prices went up the same way they always have not because minimum was raised that is the point. You are saying that automatically the wage increase will cause this but that is not what happened in the past. All prices go up over time. Actually I could buy alot more back when I made 3.45 an hour than I could today on 5.15. "

" "To KW": That is a flawed statement, because they make tips, which would push their average wage higher than the federal minimum wage (in most cases). "To Mandan": do you have percentages on the age groups associated with that minimum wage number? How about other circumstances surrounding them? It is easy to give a big number and say it is a problem, but if 20,999 of the 21,000 you say are making minimum wage are actually 17 and younger living with their parents with no overhead, do you think that will make a difference, besides just giving more money to pre-voting kids? "

" While in college, my brother worked as a server at Perkins and with tips, he averaged $12 per hr. MW is not gonna effect servers, they are paid a set base that will not be changed with the MW bill. Their tips are accounted and when averaged out might average from $9 to $15 pr hr. The figures I refer to are right from the Job Service website. I didn't make them up. "

" I think those of you who see the increase as a good thing are dead wrong. Not all boats are going to float higher on this rising tide. Are you saying that when minimum wage increases $2 an hour that you are going to get a $2 an hour raise also? Don't hold your breath. Mandan: You say that the price increases never happened last time they raised minimum wage. So then you are saying that the prices now are the same as when minimum wage was $3.45 - I highly doubt it. When companies have to pay more for fuel - prices go up. When companies have to pay more for wages, they will just all eat that as a loss? I don't think so. You people have to remember something. Money doesn't just magically appear. If you force someone (business) to pay more money, they are going to seek thier own compensation to make up the loss. That compensation comes in the form of higher priced goods. The person who just got the $2 and hour raise has to spend the extra amount to buy the same goods that he bought before for less money. Money changes hands back and forth. Forcing one side of the equation forces a change on the other side as well. For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. Nowhere is this statment more true than Economics "

" to Jim~ look again~ they go as low as 3.35 for waitstaff~ and the majority of jobs are LOW~ nothing highpaying "

" to Jim S actually about 21,000 people are paid minimum in this state so it does make a difference. "

" What difference is it going to make to raise MW when no one pays that low. I was looking at Job Service and the lowest paid jobs of any poisted anywhere were $7.50 per hour. "

" A rising tide floats ALL boats. "

" to Mike R I agree with the minimum being a farce but there is a difference, I believe that there should be a living wage where people do not need to be on assistance of any kind. We do though need a minimum because companies would just lower their wages, which in ND we do not need any lower. What you are saying about prices going up is the same argument years ago that people brought up when they raised the minimum from 3.45 all the way to the whopping 5.15 but that did not happen. Obviously they are not going to raise it very quickly either, along with the fact it only goes through here if the Fed Gov passes it, God forbid the legislature does something right before they see what the Fed Gov does. "

" You are right, Karla, the Republicans liked to pull out the old, tired "compassionate conservative" label for themselves when it came to the minimum wage bill, a bill they had earlier gutted when introduced by the Democrats. To see Rick Berg there made me want to vomit, as if he gave a rat's behind for the working people. Moreover, for this bill to become active, the feds have to pass a minimum wage law...so this bill did nothing and the Repugs sought to make political hay with it. We can all hope that the Republicans, on both the national and state level, continue say and do anti-labor, anti-women, anti-separation of church and state things so there is yet another sweeping out of the bums. "

" Minimum wage is a farce. Raising it does exactly the opposite of what it is intended to do. Raising the minimum wage actually takes money away from a lot of people who work for a living. Now before anyone goes berzerk on me, just pay attention for a while. Minimum wage goes up $2 an hour. Simple economics dictates that paying more in wages is in turn going to raise prices of goods to offset the wage increase. So now everyone pays more for everything they buy. Someone mentioned the daycare thing being so expensive, but did anyone stop to think that when the price of everything else goes up, Daycare is probably going to go up right along with it? It will, and I guaruntee it. So now you have minimum wage $2 an hour more than before, but those making minimum wage doen't have any more money than they did before because they pay more for everything they buy. For them it is a wash - nothing accomplished. The people making more than minimum wage actually end up losing money. They too are paying more for everything they buy, but thier wages don't increase. If you are working for say $10 an hour and the minumum wage is increased, do you think you will all of a sudden be getting $12 an hour? No you won't. Most likely you will still be getting $10 an hour, but because of the increase in minimum wage, that $10 an hour actually buys less than it did before. State or Federal mandated minimum wage is a Big Government idea that makes people feel all warm and fuzzy inside but actually hurts your bottom line more than it helps it - no matter what you are making per hour. Simple Economics, but far to difficult for most people to grasp. "

" they could if they were willing to pay someone to do it correctly~ "

" It seems funny to me that with modern technology that the Tribune cannot find a way to keep all of the web comments made on their stories for more than a day. Every day, I look at previous stories to see comments I missed, and everyday they are gone. Very dissappointing, I do appreciate the opportunity to make comments, but they should be kept for at least a few days like they used to be. "

" I think the minimum wage bill is a good thing. You have single parents out there who are trying to take care of their children and go to school but can only get a part time job and we all now that most of them pay minimum wage. I am not going back to school and am not a single parent but I do have a husband and 3 kids that we need to support and with the pay rate the way it was we were struggling to keep food on the table for our family. We did it but it was hard. "

" The Republican majority must really think we're stupid. Based on the popularity that the minimum wage started to garner, the killed the Dems bills and came out with their own minimum wage bill that's pretty meaningless and is without balls. When is our state going to start being in favor of progressing our state instead of enjoying its mediocrity? "